How pro-active approach to marijuana can offer big boost for T&T tourism and agriculture

“If we were to go all the way and legalise marijuana for both medicinal and recreational purposes, think about the effects it could have on boosting and differentiating our basically still-born tourism product… The potential to revitalise the local economies of rural villages hardest hit by our recession is obvious.

“Equally obvious, however, is the fact that this potential exists for practically every other Caribbean island. Which is why it is so important for us to be the first to do it.”

The following column, which proposes decriminalisation of marijuana as a part of the diversification enterprise, was submitted to Wired868 by Jabal Hassanali, a Trinidadian who is currently living and working in Japan:

Photo: Former United States president Barack Obama smokes marijuana during his college years.
Photo: Former United States president Barack Obama smokes marijuana during his college years.

I intended to sit down and write about marijuana legalisation for publication on 4/20, Weed Day. But in typical stoner fashion, I kind of just procrastinated, which is one of the many proclivities of hard-core stoners. Some three weeks have now passed and here am I hoping it is still timely.

You see, I want to argue that, as a country, we in T&T are way behind where we need to be if we are to properly leverage the immense benefits—financial and otherwise—a bold, sure-footed step in this direction can potentially bring.

Now the key words in that sentence are ‘bold’ and ‘sure-footed.’ Anything less can result in horrible consequences, so the stakes are high. The recent track record of our politicians on both those counts does not exactly inspire confidence. And no—in case you’re wondering—boldfacedness is not the same thing as boldness.

In this context, ‘bold’ means being a pioneer, having the wherewithal to recognize that change is indisputably coming and bravely trying to take in front and shape how this change will impact you rather than being a passive reactor when the system has already been designed and shaped for you without your input.

It is exactly the sort of leadership the Honourable Ralph Gonsalves urged his fellow Caricom leaders to adopt almost four years ago, before we end up consuming “the medical/health, cosmetic and other products derived from marijuana, legally grown and produced, in the USA.”

Photo: A pharmacist at a medical marijuana store in Colorado, United States.
Photo: A pharmacist at a medical marijuana store in Colorado, United States.

The response was, at best, lukewarm; in the years since, a regional Marijuana Commission has been appointed, to be supported by the Caricom Secretariat. And that’s about it really.

Dr Gonsalves has gone on to push for national consultations within his native St Vincent but there seems to be nothing happening here in Trinidad and Tobago, a so-called regional leader. Instead, we seem to be clinging desperately and hoping against hope that the boons generated from bold decisions made more than a generation ago will last just a little longer.

Now what do I mean by ‘sure-footed’? Well, in any endeavour, there will always be known unknowns and unknown unknowns, so I’m not talking about complete confidence bordering on wilful ignorance. Rather, in crafting legislation, one must be cognizant of the status quo, the policy objectives one is trying to achieve, the drawbacks and how best they can be mitigated and the feasibility of implementation/resources required.

Far too often, however, this is not the case. I often wonder why, in a country that produces bucket-loads of lawyers who are trained in critical thinking, so many of our laws seem merely copied and pasted from other jurisdictions.

Now, after taking in all this, let’s explore the possibilities.

Photo: A legal marijuana store in Colorado, United States.
Photo: A legal marijuana store in Colorado, United States.

If we were to go all the way and legalise marijuana for both medicinal and recreational purposes, think about the effects it could have on boosting and differentiating our basically still-born tourism product. Think Amsterdam, except with way better weather and scenery.

A marijuana experience tailored to any tourist profile, from backpackers seeking out the ‘Coffee shops’ dotted along the North Coast villages, to the more traditional sand/sea/sun aficionado smoking a custom-made, hand-rolled MADE IN TRINIDAD AND TOBAGO joint on the veranda of his/her rented villa in Tobago overlooking the Caribbean Sea.

The potential to revitalise the local economies of rural villages hardest hit by our recession is obvious. Equally obvious, however, is the fact that this potential exists for practically every other Caribbean island.

Which is why it is so important for us to be the first to do it. While we may never be able to match the brand recognition and cultural affinity to marijuana that Jamaica enjoys, being the first Caribbean country to fully legalize and regulate the marijuana industry at least puts us in the conversation.

The world will watch with bated breath and report on it. That’s extensive—and free!—publicity we could never hope to afford otherwise.

Photo: Dancehall star Damian "Junior Gong" Marley, the son of late reggae icon Bob Marley, has a smoke.
Photo: Dancehall star Damian “Junior Gong” Marley, the son of late reggae icon Bob Marley, has a smoke.

Our strategic location near South America is another factor to consider. It puts us within touching distance of a largely untapped market of thousands of adventure seeking/backpacking enthusiasts who trek through that continent every year.

And while we are miles away from where we need to be, both from a safety and public transport perspective, it is precisely those types of tourists who are more willing to take that risk in pursuit of an experience with a difference.

On the subject of crime, the benefits of decriminalization for possession of small amounts have been clearly demonstrated across a number of jurisdictions, both in countries boasting developing and developed status. The courts are less clogged with trivial matters and the administration of justice runs that little bit more smoothly.

Lady Justice herself becomes a little bit fairer for, as we all know, the prosecution of those crimes was heavily skewed against members of the lower economic classes, especially those who themselves aren’t fair enough to begin with.

Still, I would argue, decriminalization of that sort does not go far enough. And, what is more, given the culture of this place, it can have some nasty repercussions.

Photo: Smoke that...
Photo: Smoke that…

For one thing, given that demand will still be supplied by the black market, it will invariably further enrich criminal organisations. Yes, marijuana is nowhere near as dangerous—or lucrative—as cocaine, but many of the importers/suppliers peddle both substances and you would have to be extremely naïve to not recognize that the weed trade is responsible for its own fair share of the gun violence and homicides that take place every year.

The more money there is to be fought over, the worse will be the in-fighting.

With our laissez-faire approach to everything, I can easily see a policy of small amounts decriminalisation spiralling, emboldening more people to pursue illegal growing operations. Much of this will take place under the cover of tropical forests and other ecologically sensitive areas that are laxly monitored and already under siege.

Give Trinis an inch and they take a mile. Decriminalization fosters an environment of uncertainty, and it is under these Wild, Wild West conditions, that bullies, on either side of the law, make the rules, to the detriment of the ordinary citizen.  A well thought out legal regulatory framework, however, while not outright eliminating these repercussions, would go a long way towards addressing them.

Licensed growers can be redirected to operate in the areas we want them to. Agriculture is in desperate need of a champion and marijuana might just be the unlikely candidate to fill that need.

Photo: Late reggae star Peter Tosh sits in a marijuana field for the cover of his album "Legalize It."
Photo: Late reggae star Peter Tosh sits in a marijuana field for the cover of his album “Legalize It.”

Prime agricultural lands in Aranguez, Chaguaramas and areas in Central Trinidad are being lost at an alarming rate owing to a weakly enforced planning system, as I recently described in these pages. They are instead ‘regularised’ into other more ‘valuable’ uses such as light industrial (warehousing), housing and petting zoos.

‘Light industrial’ implies manufacturing but often these warehouses just store imported goods to be sold at marked-up prices by our oh-so-innovative entrepreneurial class.

Editor’s Note: Wired868 will publish Part Two of Jabal Hassanali’s column on Sunday 21 May.

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  1. “Once the UN does make the necessary adjustment, the floodgates will open and the rest of the world—including major bandwaggonists Trinidad and Tobago—will all of a sudden see this as a non-issue. So if we take the risk now, where, realistically, in the Western Hemisphere would the diplomatic backlash come from? Certainly not the USA, who are skidding along on a technicality, state by state, and have lost the moral authority to protest.
    “This article does not seek to win you over by convincing you that marijuana is a wonder drug for the healing of the nation or that smoking it is merely some harmless vice. It simply seeks to remind all that you cannot stop an idea whose time has come, which is the case with marijuana. Maybe, it seeks simply to suggest, we in T&T can capitalise on it.”

  2. Just re-legalize de dam ting. Seventy years ago when it was legal nobody dead and nobody get sick. Stop following US crap and start making our own laws.

  3. trinis doh care about that , is always quick fixes, then we hold our heads and bawl and blame whichever government in power. We like it so

  4. We sincerely want to attract potheads? Like we don’t already have a healthy crop of pothead tourists as it is? Clearly someone is fooling themselves if they don’t know that we are already a thriving marijuana tourist destination. People share a spliff as readily as they share a Carib.

    Add to the annoyance of potheads roaming the streets, we can’t, or rather don’t, enforce existing laws properly. How do we intend to protect the youth from abusing weed? For all the purported benefits, studies are increasingly showing that use by teenagers and pre-teens can and does have a deleterious effect on their immature, incomplete brains with life long negative consequences. Further, our instructions and social services are not equipped to deal with persons suffering from addiction and the impact on families, society and the economy as it is. When we decriminalize or even legalize cannabis, can we cope with the fall out?

    I have no problem with informed adults choosing to recreate by lighting up. I also am happy to see that medicinal uses are being properly explored. But we should approach legitimised marijuana tourism carefully.

  5. Exactly, how will this improve society? Clear some court backlogs but what about the consequences?

  6. Trinidadians including successive governments is similar to the ostrich, they bury their heads in the sand and pretend, or ignore pertinent issues. Instead the ostrich leaves his rear is exposed for someone to shoot it off. That’s us. People want to justify legalizing marijuana, Why? Someone give me a justifiable reason

  7. we are sovereign country, so why do we think we must continue to follow the US failed policies. End ‘corporal punishment ‘was an adhoc and political decision. Where are we 3 decades later? Violence in schools and beating their teachers. A number of Education policies were adopted which have failed in the US and today we have people with PhDs , MSc and degrees and they are ‘vacuous’ and are unable to function in the work place.History removed from most schools but you want youths to be patriotic. Why didn’t they adopt European countries education system. . Similiarly, the US through the WTO killed the bananas industry in the small island developing states of the Caribbean countrie, while our coconut and cocoa industry was abandoned. Today we trying to revive it.since coconut is the best thing since slice bread and we have the 2nd best cocoa in the world. When will politicians learn and listen to technocrats. they all have their own opinions on how things are done.When their party lose they just slide back into oblivion with no accountability or no jail. WE LIKE IT SO IN T&T since we the citizens do nothing

  8. This is like countries and states that lack natural resources; without fail they resort to vice. Gambling, legal prostitution, reduced taxes on company formation… its the same thing all over

    • Ever thought to be a fundamentalist pastor?
      For the more Amish?
      In an ISIS stronghold, like, Raqqa?

    • On a serious note, your comment starts on a gross error
      Trinidad, actually , has, sits, and frivols away, like the gas on its oil tower flares, burning in ignorance, much, many and varied natural resources.
      It is just that we only used one, oil, and them (colonial powers) used it, not us .

      But to this day, we destroy our natural assets , leave them waving wasting away, instead of harness.

      Development Economists call them (brain seize)…
      Comparable something..what one person or country has that no one else does..

      The fact is, and the literature bears it out, as does the state of the country, condition of our human mindset, the societal mentality.. All prove, we developed wrong. Took the wrong path.

      When they made up douen, did they know it was so apt to oil and its curses. Faceless, feet opposite to front. Aborted. Undeveloped?

  9. the website about looks at the marijuana in St Lucia and st Vincent. The thing is with the collapse of the banana industry they had to seek an alternative. T&T has oil and this may not be applicable for us, but its a good read

  10. file:///C:/Users/Rosana/Downloads/767-1671-1-SM.pdf

    • the thing is that Colorado didn’t know these things going in. We do now. Any properly contemplated legislative framework will encompass all of the learned examples from across the board.
      In fact, some of these issues were raised before Colorado adopted their legislation. Those voices were largely ignored.

    • so why we want to go this way? expedient for whom?

    • 20 years ago T&T had about 13-15% arable land under cultivation. Today that is less than 10%
      our prefered food crops are not sustaining a square meal. high value crops, like watermelon, pawpaw and broccoli are exported. agri business in T&T is in a crisis worse than when cocoa slumped or when sugar cane markets in the EU were closed off. this is worse than when the EU locked off winwards islands banana sales to the UK.
      T&T land profiles don’t tend to encourage mechanised farming practices, so any major development in this sector will mean jobs. with high USD earnings potential that will also mean competitive jobs in agriculture.

    • Rossana, I don’t think that story pointed to anything that wasn’t mentioned before in our discussions.
      The increased hospitalizations might be because people were less likely to go to the hospital before when it was illegal.
      None of the other stuff is insurmountable. You’d expect legalization leads to more consumption. That’s the point.
      And you have to do all you can to keep it out of the hands of minors. Just like alcohol and cigarettes which are both legal.

    • there is overwhelming evidence that drug abuse is linked to pee-existing mental health issues. depression, anxiety, OCD, social maladjustment, personality disorders…it’s hard to disconnect the fact of the prevalence of these underlying issues, coupled with the propensity of modern social programming to medicate everyone for everything.
      do drug addicts have addictions because of the availability of drugs? or because they’re wired to be addicts?
      How does legalization change the availability of drugs that can be bough-albeit illicitly—at any street corner in the known world?

    • Are we living in the same country? Are people wearing blinders? Why don’t people face reality in this country? What do you mean keep out of the hands of minors. This country is full of laws and lack implementation. There are 9 year old and up smoking pot and have guns.the reason…easy accessibility .Are we speaking about Trinidad or am I alone living here? Marijuana 5 pc cheap on every block in every area. Only the police don’t know where it is , (sarcasm) and guns for rent . What law? Really. if this wasn’t not so serious it would be laughable, particularly when you think people who know better is justifying the madness and for what end? i pray for my granddaughter daily since she is coming up in this mad mad world led by the ‘intellegentsia’ and not common sense, which ain’t so common

    • this is exactly the point though—what changes with legalisation? nothing, really, except that people won’t be charged with possession or trafficking. availability is a function of supply and demand, not legality

  11. Lasana Liburd pardon my tardiness, been crazy busy. I honestly don’t think the Politicians here intend to even have this discussion, at least not this generation. Remember, topics such as LGBT, Sex Ed in Schools and of course drugs are still considered taboo here in T&T. The CJ thought outside the box one time and just suggested decriminalisation, people almost lost their minds Lasana. I honestly don’t think we are ready.

  12. There are articles on the devastating effect since legalizing marijuana in some of the US states. Always want to copy the US. More importantly if and when its legalize, remember all those in jail for that particular offense have to be freed. More than that who will want to plant food, when the market is for marijuana. Also there are studies on vagrancy and one of its’ contributing factor (drugs). Studies have also shown the progression cigarette , marijuana, cocaine, heroin.Think long and hard bandwaggonists of the long term effects of this suggestion. What tourism? Really

    • We don’t have to release anyone. They broke the law. That’s why they are in jail.
      And even if marijuana is legal, people still have to eat. If everyone sold any one particular thing, the market would be flooded and they couldn’t earn anything for it. I am not worried about that. Watermelons cost more than a five piece anyway and will remain popular.

    • My daddy has a farm , I know the story of agriculture as the bastard child in this country. It gets the smallest budgetary allocation for decades) Farming is on the decline, planting marijuana has been on the rise for years , No competition. How many marijuana raids over the years ? Anyone gets hold, and where does it go? Some are burned , but the rest goes to you know who (rogue elements in (TT ,,,,,) selling and exporting . Farmers are not subsidised like abroad, people want fast money. An acre of marijuana reps more monies than an acre of tomato etc.(Only the PP Minister man who plant pumpkin in Tobago was able to build a mansion in less than 6 mths) This is real life. Plus our food bill is in the billions, serving the ‘ parasitic oligarchy’ that is businessmen. EXPLAIN to me how marijuana can positively contribute to TOURISM. My heart bleeds when I walk into POS and see mainly African men as vagrant.s Many of them are due to drugs, (a friend of mine works in social development and they interviewed many of them. )an eyesore in the heart of OUR capital Look at John John by the car park where they live. Who is addressing that,?So an idea is to open the flood gates to legalizing marijuana. Were any studies done to foresee the ramifications for the country social and economic. Yet again another adhoc quick scheme solution.

  13. Part of even having a discussion on tge topic is to find people who have dismissed themselves from the colonial western paradigm messages, along with, black is bad, women are evil, there is a jesus, and weed makes you go mad.

    Kind like how they told us and the rest of indigenous and Africans that our natural foods were bad and we needed soybeans and who at.

    God rest the queen.

  14. I’m loving the debate and responses this article is generating. I hope the detractors stick around and give part II a read (shameless plug) because I touch on many of the same issues being brought up (albeit not with the depth I would ideally like to). This article is definitely not about following the US; a model I agree has its fair share of problems. It’s really about thinking for ourselves and finding our own way. For that to occur, open and honest debate is required, so I am encouraged by this start.

  15. The big problem I have is that for decades we heard weed is a gateway drug, it’s addictive, it causes mental illness, it ruins your health… all of a sudden when american states need money it’s ‘this weed thing might not be so bad!’ I have a problem with people making money off of the destruction of our young people.

    • “smoking” weed is bad.
      There’s a LOT of medical and scientific evidence—in respected, peer-reviewed journals and publications—that point to the benefits of other, safer modes of consumption. Cannabis oil, for instance. this can be used in comestibles and directly.
      There are people who are trying to isolate the positive benefits from the psychotropic effects, to make a true “medical marijuana” that doesn’t get you “high”

    • Who would want that? Getting high is the point.

    • nahhh…say, for instance, yuh got a kid with cancer and you wanna try a cannabis treatment. you ain want lil Johnny catching jollys whole time, on a body high for 12 hours.
      That might be great for her mom..cause she might need a break from reality, but especially for pediatric cannabis medication…this is a major concern for skeptics.

    • from the article: “I intended to sit down and write about marijuana legalisation for publication on 4/20, Weed Day. But in typical stoner fashion, I kind of just procrastinated, which is one of the many proclivities of hard-core stoners. Some three weeks have now passed and here am I hoping it is still timely.”

    • I don’t think anyone would have a problem with that but I get the sense that the majority of proponents want to smoke it.

    • yeah. thats based on current user profiles. AKA Stoners.
      the expanded market is looking at a much wider user base to expand the industry…liquids and comestibles being the main target. infused/medicated wines…whole other world. smoking might be a thing of the past in the future hahahaha

    • Wow.. strong words.. This may not be official ‘research’ or a peer reviewed ‘study’ that you all seem to swear by, but allow me to share some anecdotal evidence from my own personal experience. No doubt, much easier to discount but I am quietly confident will ring true for many. Then maybe the hysteria will die down a bit and we can debate this a bit more critically. I personally know a lot of people who smoke weed in this country on an at least habitual basis. I know far more, like myself, who have tried it once or twice and decided it’s not for them. In my generation, I know very few who have never tried it. For those that smoke habitually, they run the gamut from ‘high society’ (no pun intended) to ‘groundsmen’. From Scholars to drop outs. Captain to cook. Prime Ministers (allegedly) to daily paid public servants. The vast majority that I know are otherwise law abiding citizens. Very few engage in criminality but I don’t think their weed habit is a big determining factor in that. Some are extremely successful, either in their careers, personal life or both. A few credit marijuana as a significant factor in their success and I don’t disbelieve them. Others are successful in spite of their marijuana habit. A few I have clearly observed have dependency issues, and while it may not be as extreme as say cigarette addiction, marijuana have become part of their daily routine and without it their mood darkens, they get irritable and suffer withdrawal. Very few I know dabble in harder drugs, far less graduate to them. Again, I think there are far more extenuating circumstances than marijuana that would lead to that decision. The notion of somebody saying “Marijuana not doing it for me anymore, I think I’m going to try some coke” seems extremely simplistic to me. Especially within our Caribbean context where cocaine is so heavily (and rightfully) demonized in our popular culture (even elders can agree that Dancehall and Dub music got that one thing right). As compared to say the UK or Europe where cocaine is far less taboo and viewed with less suspicion. It is therefore easier for the ‘gateway’ theory to be applicable in that instance. So yes, while marijuana is certainly no miracle drug, on a scale of 1 to 10 (10 being cigarettes), its probably a solid 6 or 7. A young teenager who happens upon cigarettes is far more likely to be ‘destroyed’ than one who is peer pressured into trying marijuana.

    • sensible, personal, anecdotal. but sensible.

  16. Go the Dutch way..licensed coffee shops, with no smoking in public, eg parks, streets etc.

  17. the problem side of both the Amsterdam and the Colorado models is the grow side.
    In Amsterdam (which is now being contested legally and policy change is in play now) you can grow 5 plants per person per room indoor. BUT…you cant have professional hydro equipment, like grow lights and stuff.
    OUTDOOR grow is a different thing, as this law generally doesnt cover that aspect. hence loophole.
    In Colorado there arent any buying limits or grow limits, however, the 3-month grow window means that commercial scale planting requires huge infrastructure investments.
    In both cases what happens is the massive infiltration of contraband supply that gets resold as “local” supply.

    • There is a grow limit in Colorado for personal usage too. What happens is the police shows up and says: “Dennis, we understand you have more than your allotted six plants.”
      Then you say: “You are also seeing plants belonging to Cherisse, Jason, Gyasi…”
      Then the police has to check all those people to see if it adds up.
      Talk about a waste of police time. Lol.

    • yuh understand! LOL
      So instead of running down criminals, popo focus on catching people with more plants and who flowering and what not…

    • Lol. You need something to test if drivers high. To ensure minors not getting their hands on legal stuff though stuff like weed brownies and so on.
      It all needs careful planning and legislation. But I think it should be done personally.

    • yes. Youth development issues, consumption issues all remain regardless of the legality of the product.
      People using it regardless

    • You know after the st James cancer center debacle is when I thought to go illegal and bake mj products.

      At the time the center was poisoning people to death, my two uncles included, and there was a pain meds shortage.

      Talked to a few people to get into an indoor production.

  18. The Colorado model makes me nervous though. Amsterdam seems to be recreational/tourism inspired. Colorado is capitalism meets marijuana. Lol.

    • Completely agree here. We need to develop our own model of regulation to deal with the spill off effects of legalisation.
      One of the spill of effects that is of particular concern to me is the potential for abuse and the lack of infrastructure to deal with abuse.
      I am all for legalization but we need to do it very carefully.
      On another note I would hate to see a general legalisation only to bend a knee to foreign corporations and their methods if exploitation and branding.

  19. This is long overdue. Too much unwarranted paranoia about freeing up de herb.

  20. there are currently two major models for legal weed: the Colorado model and the Amsterdam model.
    Neither of these countries have a 24/7-365 outdoor grow season. That is critical.
    The Caribbean country that fully embraces legal grow+use policy will face the other monumental task of branding their ganja. Rihanna and the Marleys have already created brands. it is time our own 420 activists go all-in and do the same.
    How would the public respond to a MM or Bunji brand? Lara. Dwight with a 20 acres in Roxborough….Jillionaire smokes? we need to start being REAL about this critical issue. we’re on the clock

    • Well, that might counter the point that it frees up law enforcement to tackle “more important issues”, which is often used.
      Police will have to ensure that the marijuana trade operates within certain perimeters.
      I agree that the topic needs serious discussion and soon. Maybe the wrong people have been involved so far.
      If we are looking at things like tourism, business and agriculture, then the talk should not only include people from the health, crime and religious sectors.

    • EXACTLY!
      The law gets lost with marijuana. There is no equivalent to a breathalyzer for marijuana consumption. so while it is assumed that driving or operating a vehicle while high on ganja may pose some credible danger, there is no way to monitor how high a mofo is.
      There are may other issues with recreational use and the law as well. Police tend to focus on the other trivial aspects of possession law and not transfer resources to other serious crimes

    • A cousin of mine had his first ‘pull’ around age 15. Unfortunately, it was laced with some other drug. He has been in and out of St. Anns since then. There have been decades of advocacy for decriminalization but I firmly believe we need to discuss safety and abuse openly as well. It is now illegal to advertise tabacco, I firmly believe that sporting personalities and local celebrities should refrain from endorsing marijuana products as well.

    • understood. i only used these names to illustrate the issue.
      They allow vape to advertise. why? so much BS here

    • Well we know capitalism can make marijuana seem like a must have thing eh Ezra. That’s the danger when capitalism takes over.
      Don’t think for a moment that the community Rasta man is going to become a millionaire when marijuana is legalized eh.
      Big business would swoop in hard with their institutional knowledge.

    • Lacing, content, quality, variety, and varietals are different matters from abuse . safety aspects for sure.

      And yes, lacing is a very real problem.
      Most oldheads stopped smoking because of that.

      But when you build a proper industry, there are controls.

      Sorry to read about your cousin that is a very real risk. Up to today.

      But since before 2010, this legalization, medical and recreational marijuana issue has been on my list of economic diversification.

      Used to talk to the Dr in Jamaica who was researching thc levels, and a rasta guy in Columbia who advocates researching as well. He used to be on my fb page till I cleaned shop.

      Beyond this very necessary option, the pappies won’t let us. Too much money to share and lose. It is illegal to keep us out, while they manufacture, market and distribute.

      NY legalized and raised bars to prevent entry of a certain kind

    • You know the thing well Lasana

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