Wired868 Wired868 for smart sport news and opinion
On 8 October, 2013, Newsday published a letter to the editor, headlined “Say no to gay marriages” and signed by Valentine Young, with which I fully agreed. Young’s position was that the legalisation of same-sex marriages had brought God’s wrath upon the United States of America (certain states anyway) because their sanctioning of homosexuality is a departure from the word of God.
Because I had already addressed that issue of homosexuality in my writing, I left it there.
Not long afterwards, another letter, headlined “No link between gay unions, storms” and signed by Kristie Harnarine, appeared in the Trinidad Express. It sought to refute Young’s assertions and essentially expressed approval of same-sex relationships and marriage.
And having read it, I also left it there.
“Whatever,” I told myself. “I’m so tired of these people deluding themselves into believing that homosexuality and other such categories of sexual orientation are okay. They propose all manner of foolish arguments to persuade others that that is so and to put their own guilty minds at rest and make themselves feel comfortable.”
And I was going good, I was really going good… until one morning I read another letter in the Newsday, headlined “Proud of myself.” In it, one A. Khan notes that, while he comes from a religious family, he now proudly proclaims his homosexuality, embraces his LGBTQI friends and is secure in the knowledge that God loves him.
Let’s sort this thing out once and for all. If you want to be gay, go ahead, suit yourself. But do not use the name of God to legitimize your cause, do not twist His words and do not dishonour His name.
There is nothing in the word of God that even remotely suggests that He approves of such behaviour. God does not sanction homosexuality or any other of the LGBTQI categories. In fact, throughout the Bible, there is explicit confirmation of God’s disapproval of homosexual and other similar acts.
For instance, Genesis 19:1-11 shows clearly that God frowns on homosexuality. God is preparing, in this passage of scripture, to destroy the City of Sodom and He sends a couple of angels in human form to rescue Lot and his family. When Lot invites the angels to pass the night at his home, some of the homosexuals in the city show up at Lot’s house seeking to have sex with his guests. The angels pull Lot into the house and blind the homosexuals.
Leviticus 18:22 is unequivocal. “Do not practise homosexuality,” it warns, “having sex with another man as with a woman. It is a detestable sin.”
Similarly, Leviticus 20:13 is categorical. “If a man practises homosexuality,” it says, “having sex with another man as with a woman, both men have committed a detestable act.”
In Judges 19:16-24, the story is told of an old man who takes in a couple of travellers, one male and one female, for the night. Some homosexuals in the area, aware of the presence of the travellers in the elderly man’s house, show up with the undisguised intention of having sex with the man. His host would have none of it.
“No, my brothers,” he chides them, “don’t do such an evil thing (…) don’t do such a shameful thing to this man.”
“Evil” and “shameful” aren’t my words; they’re right there in God’s word.
But, some may protest, that stuff comes from the Old Testament; we are long past the days when we should allow ourselves to be guided by the Old Testament. So wthout agreeing that the teachings of the Old Testament are no longer valid, I shall add a couple of passages from the New Testament that re-affirm what we have already seen in the Old.
We can begin with Romans 1:18-32. “…God shows his anger from heaven against all sinful, wicked people who suppress the truth by their wickedness,” we read.
(Copyright Elvert Barnes)
“Yes, they knew God, but they wouldn’t worship him as God or even give him thanks. And they began to think up foolish ideas of what God was like… That is why God abandoned them to their shameful desires. Even the women turned against the natural way to have sex and instead indulged in sex with each other. And the men, instead of having normal sexual relations with women, burned with lust for each other…”
“…sinful, wicked people…,” “…shameful desires…,” “…the natural way to have sex…,” “…normal sexual relations…” No comment necessary, I think.
“Don’t you realize that those who do wrong will not inherit the Kingdom of God?” 1 Corinthians 6:9-11 asks. “Don’t fool yourselves. Those who indulge in sexual sin, or who worship idols, or commit adultery, or are male prostitutes, or practice homosexuality, none of these will inherit the Kingdom of God.”
I don’t think I need to go on. I trust that such confusion as there might have been is now securely laid to rest.
And that neither Mr Harnarine nor Mr Khan nor anyone else of their ilk any longer harbours any illusions about how strong is the Living God’s active disapproval of their perverted lifestyles.
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Akilah Holder is a former college lecturer and journalist whose strong convictions often win her enemies, which does not faze her. She lives by the mantra ‘ignore the ignorant,’ has already published one book and has her own blog at https://intelligenttalk.wordpress.com/
As you mentioned Trevor Noah, he did a really great piece on another ignorant anti-gay person, a prominent politician in Kenya by the name of Ezekiel Mutua whose reaction to two male lions in their wildlife preserve who were seen engaging in same-sex behavior (as many mammalian species have been observed to do in the wild by biologists) was beyond comical and ignorant. https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=210&v=997CnhOlodQ
Ah! Not the kind of article I would choose to read. According to my dimpled Trevor Noah who I wished I had bounced up this carnival….Ain’t nobody got time for that. I imagine the comments on this to be as varied and vexatious as I figure the article would be. So happy Valentines to everybodeee❤
It’s an issue we’re living with in the world so I don’t see this as taboo to post or is it only to be spoken of in whispers and behind closed doors? I agree that people have a choice in the the lifestyle they choose. What I don’t understand is why the need to have this union blessed by the very God who calls this lifestyle an abomination and states that those engaging in it have no part in his kingdom. He won’t bless it. Just have a civil union and be done with it. Btw, do the Hindus, muslims and other religions perform same sex marriages? I must google it.
Most of the first world have debated homosexuality extensively. Their gay citizens were put through a barrage of judgement and sometimes hate filled speech from people who were determined to deny their right to love and be loved in a consensual adult relationship. Eventually the population settled it by a vote. Gay marriage was legalised and the population moved on. We are all sinners in one way or another. If there is a God I hope he has mercy on us all.
God just don’t have mercy on us just like that. You have to repent of your sins and mean it so Good will forgive you.
Not because some states legalize same sex marriage it’s right. God gave us Adam and Eve and not Adam and Steve. The Bible said it’s wrong so it’s wrong. Don’t try to sugar coat something that is wrong in the sight of God. We will eventually pass like Sodom and Gomorroh.
I respect your right to follow your beliefs. I also believe in basic human rights regardless of sexual orientation as long as it is between consenting adults.
The whole scenario is wrong. God gave us some rules to follow and there is a punishment if we don’t follow it so how can a right thinking human being agree with same sex marriage. This is Shameless and disgusting. If they want to do this nasty things keep it to themselves and don’t flaunt it in the public. It makes some people like me want to puke. If they don’t repent their judgement day will come. Disgusting!
Lydia Joseph I respect your right to your opinion based on your interpretation of scripture. I don’t interpret it the same way.
Hahaha! Yes l agree we are all sinners without a doubt but you don’t sit and wallow in sin. You try to get out of it not remain in it. It doesn’t matter what or who you are trying to justify but same sex marriage is a sin and will always remain a sin. God frowned on that. Read your Bible about Sodom and Gomorroh. If you are a Christian you wouldn’t be saying such nonsense. If you aren’t one then make an effort to straighten your life with God. I don’t usually argue about politics and religion but when l see someone posting nonsense it about such things l have to.
I have considered your comments, respect your right to your opinion and have decided that I stand by my original post. Thank you for your concern for my soul.
Like any other news source, Wired868 sometimes shares letters that we might disagree with in part. Or we might disagree with in whole.
The idea is not to promote divisiveness and discord. But to listen to our neighbors and, when necessary, to challenge or even dismantle their arguments.
We promise never to drown our readers in toxic, vexatious arguments. But we would never want to be an echo chamber either and are confident in the maturity of most of our readers to rise to the challenge.
Like any other news source, Wired868 sometimes shares letters that we might disagree with in part. Or we might disagree with in whole.
The idea is not to promote divisiveness and discord. But to listen to our neighbors and, when necessary, to challenge or even dismantle their arguments.
We promise never to drown our readers in toxic, vexatious arguments. But we would never want to be an echo chamber either and are confident in the maturity of most of our readers to rise to the challenge.
THAT THIRSTY BITCH SAID… she had an issue with gay men respectfully sharing their peace…
So she decided to spread divisiveness and discord. Do you READ or just spewing off at the fingers?
Usually people resort to insults when they don’t feel confident of their ability to properly express themselves.
Do better than that. Don’t try to fight hate with hate or intolerance with intolerance.
Lasana, I agree on advice as well.
You have a greater responsibility as part of the media. You consciously and subconsciously shape the public’s views and influence how the public treats with such issues. Your response, in my view, shows that you do not understand your responsibility to the public. I’m really disappointed in wired868 for continuing to publish this persons “work”. The article of Jan 23rd was terrible enough. I once respected this site for its balanced reporting (many times I did not agree with the articles) but this Holder person should not be given a platform to pass off ignorance as “writing” or an “article”. Not every opinion ought to be published because it can be. I don’t think I can continue to follow wired868 anymore. I’m truly truly disappointed.
Dominique, if I didn’t think our readers could handle a few verses from Leviticus without having their minds blown then I wouldn’t think much of our readers.
I respect your view and I thank you for sharing it. But believe me when I say that the easier thing for me to do would be to screen stuff that might upset my readers.
Like you said, I might already be losing readers as a result. But I believe the best way for us to advance as a people is to understand each other–good and bad–and try to find a way to arrive at consensus. And I don’t see how we can get there without dialogue.
I’m sorry to have offended you but that is why we published this view although I myself do not agree with it.
Lasana Liburd I appreciate your comments (here and below) with respect to your reasons for publishing the piece (I am being very generous in using the term piece). I do not have an issue with her quoting scripture or using it as her justification for her views. She is entitled to her opinion just like I am to mine. My problem, however, is with the promotion of views that are dangerous and potentially harmful to us as a society and a people. It is divisive. I appreciate that without differing views we can become complacent and I appreciate a good argument myself but this is not that. This is an emotive “piece” and totally unbalanced. It serves no purpose in progressing any sort of useful dialogue between different factions of society. Just like her 23rd January article, she is judging with no empirical backing. Moreover, she has missed the most important tenet of Christianity (upon which she bases her argument) what’s next? Racist rants in the interest of journalism? Promoting rape culture? Violence against women? Victim blaming? Where will you draw the line? If this is your philosophy so be it. I wish you and your website the best in the future. I say no more on this topic.
checkout James: 4:12; Hebrews 13:1- 5; John 8:7-11; Romans 1:26-28
Which translation?
Which God?
The same God that created you, created me.
All men are equal.
What anyone CHOOSES to do with any orifice with any other consenting adult, is no one’s business.
Don’t put God in yuh bigotry and hatred.
The things I want to say bout this assness Lasana Liburd…. and worse yet quoting the Bible?
Constantine’s political tool? The Bible?
“Close to the Church and far from God” my grandmother (the Reverand).
Just as expected. Why am I not surprised this will be your stance?
You looking for trouble with your ignorant ass, Kenroy.
Why you on my case? I’m straight, I’m not of you. I have a beautiful wife next to me. Find some other man to cling on to and leave me alone please
Kenroy has proven himself time and time again to be an intolerant bigot, Andrew.
….. no one said you weren’t straight : …
I feel sorry for your wife. You appear very insecure.
I’m always confused by men that feel the need to proclaim they’re straight and married so loudly and quickly………
There’s nothing that you all can say to get under my skin. My self confidence almost touching the sky. I’m very happy, comfortable contented, healthy and lots more. And most of all I sleep with a wife. So to hell with you all
Kenroy Ambris The very next time you see me, be it in the road or anywhere any function (as has happend in the past) Remember your eyes take that extra 4.8 seconds to linger on my breasts, after the 3 seonds you utlilise to inhale my aura, after the extra long 2 minute tun neck to watch my firm, blemishless glowing skin, and the Sahara desert thirstyness you adhere to strain of my dress strugfling to calm the vigor of my thigh bump… remember fornication is a sin, coveting is a sin, lust is a sin and lying?
Lying … same sin.
Why do people who obsesses over gays have this paranoia about others assuming they are gay too? I’m gonna drop this right here:
Rachel Price lol, all I can say to you is that you are not my type. I’ve much better to lust over, I even marry one. If you were my type then I would of marry you. But unfortunately for you I did not.
I will tell you Rachel Price, what I just said to another who commented. While God is a God of love, he is also just. And for that reason, he will also judge and punish sin. Exodus 15:3 tells us that God is a God of war. Matthew 10:34 tells us that he didn’t come to bring peace, but a sword to separate the just from unjust. The sinner from those who have repented.
So while indeed, we are all created equal, for we have all sinned and fallen short of the glory of God and he loves us alike, he will let go those who have not obeyed him. He loves the murderer, but doesn’t mean he will not punish the murderer. He loves the pedophile, but doesn’t mean if he doesn’t repent, he will not punish him. God loves sinners, but he will punish those who have sinned.
Are you sure you graduated from St. Francois Girls’ College? Bc your logic is very flawed. You’re not making the logical deductions. And I have to get on so, because I am tired of these sloppy, arrogant arguments by people like yourself who can’t see reason and who don’t have the moral authority to guide people. Yuh don’t.
Go ahead and open your mouth. Go ahead and open it, your famous for doing that, but I have made my point. Wisdom tells me not to argue with fools, so now that I am done making my point, may God have mercy on you.
I have no problem if it is an actual extraterrestrial, supernatural, Higher Power coming down and doing the punishing.
But that is not what is happening is it? It is other HUMAN BEINGS who are the ones asserting they have authority from that deity to bully or oppress or deny other people their Universal Human Rights. They are NOT a Higher Power greater than me, him, her or any other human. So when they start trying to elevate themselves above other human beings, and want people to believe their words based on no evidence of any supernatural or Omnipotent authorization, I will speak up!
Those who claim to be speaking for God need to put up and provide evidence. So far, all they can provide are their shallow interpretations of flawed man-made writings.
Jessica, my problem is that these bullers are producing all sorts of diseases and spreading it to innocent people. How the ass you can push your dick into a shit hole and feel comfortable doing it? That’s complete nastiness, you are spreading sickness
Akilah Holder don’t come for me…. go twiddle yuh thumbs over someone else, quick.
Metioning my alma mata is supposed to do what? Show some snippet of knowledge abour me?
Chile I’m happy in my skin, are you joyous in yours?
I live, I love and best of all I learn.
You know my age?
I’ve been here for more than a minute.
How I live is none of your business.
Who I love is none of your business.
Who I live, love and share my body with is none of your business. No business of anyone but me.
I reiterate, the God that created me, created you.
You speak of sin, as if judging my actions, my life, my choices for my life isn’t a sin as well.
When were you appointed & annointed anyone’s Savior ?
You quoteth the Bible so freely to add credence to you insipid rant & reasoning.
Tell me do you live EXACTLY according to this book ?
For Leviticus 19/19 states “You shall keep my statutes. You shall not let your cattle breed with a different kind. You shall not sow your field with two kinds of seed, nor shall you wear a garment of cloth made of two kinds of material.
I assume you’ve never worn spandex? Cotton panties with elastic? Or a silk lined bra with wire support?
Leviticus is indeed an interesting read, I again assume you do not eat of the “cloven hoof”, you’ve never had oxtail?
I speak freely, for that “freely speakin” my cup runneth over.
You have no moral authority to contest my morals, ketch yuhself.
You see my aroggance I see your envy. Ask thyself how come this duncy, loud, uncouth, vile Rachel Price is known and blameless, lily white Souled Akilah Holder is a little known blogger ?
Your gnarly fingers failing to gain attention from your keyboard.
Hating on someone for who they choose to love & share their bodies with is a sin.
Don’t spit in the sky, guess where it falls?
Om Namay Shiva.
Lasana Liburd yuh see when it reach to people calling others “buller” Kenroy Ambris… I gone.
I know where this assness heading, and that direction isn’t a positive one.
The only reason I’m in this conversation at all is because I hate bullying. I cannot stand the hypocrisy. You upset when a white man treat you as inferior but this is okay}? Kenroy, act your age, open a book… Something!!!!!
Kenroy Ambris In the Caribbean heterosexual people lead HIV Transmission and young women are the fastest growing group contracting the disease. I’ve worked with UNAIDS, and I’ve worked with sexually active men, both homosexual and heterosexual and they are BOTH spreading the disease.
Men are the main transmitters of HIV, whether homosexual or heterosexual. You will find the careless, irresponsible and selfish with regards to their sexual health and those of their partners on BOTH SIDES of the Kinsey Scale. So much so the ladies have to be putting down def poetry about it. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ctwyd9KgID4
Rachel , my apologies if it offended you but I’m still passionate about it. Most people have it in their minds but fraid to use it. You of all people are very outspoken and say it as you see it so I’m very surprised that you have issues with my comments
Little known people don’t generate this much discussion. Kenroy is right. Why such a quick exit? B/c yuh know you have no bloody point. God bless!
AND Andrew, no white man can treat me anyhow. I’m not one of those STUPID BLACK BOY who blame slavery and white people for everything that go wrong in their lives. I have a mind of my own and i use if to my benefit, not yours.
Also i dont bully anyone willfully. The same way you exercise your rights to be gay, the same way i exercise my rights to express my feelings about it. I cannot stop you and you should not try to hush me up, you will fail badly. This is me acting my age
Akilah Holder yuh could count?
You call this thread “much discussion”?
Ha !
Yuh petticoat showing, pull up yuh slip.
Get familiar with true numbers nuh … https://www.facebook.com/rachelpricett/?ref=aymt_homepage_panel
People are entitled to thoughts and feelings and to the expression of them. The problems only start when people are not self-disciplined to carry and process their own emotional weight and instead pass it on to others in the form of violence. Everyone is dealing with pain in their lives. Some are trying to refrain as much as possible from passing on their pain to others and are instead seeking healing, inner peace and learning to love self and others again. Some are giving in to the pain and letting ti drive them mad. Others are passing it on to others in the form of violence.
We have an epidemic of violence in T&T.
Akilah Holder if “bloody” is the strongest adjective in your arsenal, recognize my restraint based in pity for your vapid consciousness.
Unfortunately little known people who judge and point out the failings in others often generate a lot of hate fuelled discussion. The Hell and damnation approach just drives people away from religion and religious communities.
.
I think people are moving away from religion and want the real thing. True love and kindness. Safe, peaceful space so they can meditate and know self and dream and create. We need creative and innovative people more than ever to solve some really big problems on the horizon and do so for the betterment of all. People tired of suffering. They are ready to give something different a try.
Most atheists and agnostics I know actually display empathy and strive for a better world for their children. Most Christians I know on the other hand are divisive and judgemental and want the world to crumble. They call it the second coming or the rapture. LOL. Why would any child, given complete freedom to choose his faith, want to be a Christian? They don’t.
I understand where you are coming from. I know there are a lot of compassionate, understanding people of all faiths out there but those who blame and shame are louder sometimes, especially when it comes to pointing out what they see as ‘faults’ in others or prioritising ‘the perceived faults’ over their own. I don’t think anyone likes being on the receiving end of that. It is reflected in church attendances all over the world going down. Crime going up as people feeling increasingly on the outer of society.
Andrew Gioannetti Are you following Jessica Joseph’s thread.? Very interesting. Cheers Jo
just one thing people need to stop acting as if God was tolerant because he wasnt acc to the same foundation that they claim they recieve God from
He say ‘smite them’..thats him showing people who don’t follow his orders accountability lol
He said? Any proof it was God saying anything at all? OR was it man claiming to have heard God tell him this? All we have are people’s second hand accounts.
Hey i’m agreeing with Kyon yuh know lol..and I also agree with you lol
Perhaps it is time for God to take the stand and speak on behalf of himself for a change. It would clear everything up.
what two people do in a bedroom with their bodies is not my business
what someone what to publish or write is their right
and if God want to destroy sinners people are free to believe and support and quote that God
So if they do it in the kitchen then it becomes your business ??? ?
u might have a point there
freedom of speech
right to privacy
and freedom of religion are all principles i observe
I better go say some Hail Mary’s before I go to bed yes…I had ah urge to eat some bacon for supper
I pray to God that Ms Holder does not have a child or children who are gay. Lol@the all seeing ! I have similar questions
”
Akilah Holder is a former college lecturer and journalist whose strong convictions often win her enemies, which does not faze her. She lives by the mantra ‘ignore the ignorant,’ has already published one book and has her own blog at https://intelligenttalk at wordpress dot com/ “:
Troll.
Meen linking to that in smart
If wired is prepared to publish this bigoted trash, then will it publish outright racist articles that are justified on religious grounds? Or gender-based crimes, if ‘justified’ by religion or cultural practice?
Sadly Emir, we published a bitter racist letter two or three weeks ago.
A trini of Indo ethnicity said he hated the PNM for what he believed they did to people of his race. His pain was real but obviously twisted.
It wasn’t a call to action against blacks. I felt it gave an opportunity to address his deep deep bitterness and thankfully there were really good responses.
Honestly, I don’t know if it is worth it. This is not what I want Wired868 to be about. So I can’t tell you I’m sure it was the right decision.
But I also feel that pretending these things aren’t there doesn’t help either. Sometimes when you bring things out in the open you can disinfect it.
Had it been actively threatening a segment of the population, I’d draw the line.
I could care less about the writer…It is the publisher I dealing with. What. The. Actual. Phoque?
Honestly, the fact that the child chooses a literal interpretation shows that even in the thing that she believes that she cherry picks and chooses her quotes. THe appropriate response to her should be ten hearty “fuck yous”, since reasonable responses usually will not woirk.
The Internet is a publishing platform, which means that somewhere a view like hers will find acceptance. Not sure that W868 should be that place, unless you are giving “the other side” equal press. (which would now introduce false equivalency issues, but that is another topic for another day) The fact that her writing does not turn up in the dailies probably means that the letters to the editor not passing their smell test.
I not even bothering to read, St.Peter has to borrow the keys from them so to open the gates of heaven, and i have dealt with too many self righteous christians over the past few days, that are not going to sour me and change my relationship with GOD because of their foolishness.
As a believer in christ, I do not agree with homosexuality, (my reasons are mine), i don’t believe in injustice and bigotry either.
People often get matters of religion confused with matters of relationship with GOD. that is all i will say for now.
Rich Ian we absolutely would give the other side a voice. Would you like to try a letter?
Religious folk apparently are the only one given a pass to bully and slander.
Anything by this writer on the captioned subject is going to be bigoted.
By now they know what they’re getting from the writer, keeps publishing it…
Lasana Liburd, this article is promoting bigotry and prejudice against dispossessed persons. What are you promoting?
Lol poor Lasana. Lasana Liburd
I’m not promoting anything Rhoda. I think I need a disclaimer at end of our columns. Not for Akilah alone. There are several columns I don’t agree with in part of in their entirety.
I explained elsewhere that I had to think long and hard. It isn’t clickbait as Keita suggested. It is the opposite as it threatens our reputation and might encourage some not to take us seriously.
But that alternative view does exist. Akilah didn’t make it up. And all I can say is I am very encouraged that readers were as mature and eloquent as they were. That’s the plus.
Lasana Liburd the issue here isn’t whether you agree. It is whether your media house is publishing literature that promotes bigotry and prejudice. And this article does that…on very faulty premises….
I also think the other view, as you call it, could have been presented in a light that was more educational. Informing the listener of the other view. You are known for your satire and this could have been done similar to that. For example, CNN does stories on Trump supporters all the time and it is about showing the other side, but it is done in a way that does not imply you agree with the author. Or Saturday Night Live for example.
Rhoda, I can’t say with any certainty that I’m right about this. But I do believe that certain cancers flourish in dark but wither away in the light.
I am not convinced that not talking about makes things better. In fact, I think that is the one thing that is guaranteed not to make things better.
Keita when it comes to a letters page i can only work with what I am given. If you offered me a piece on the topic, I’d use it.
But I can’t twist someone’s work to say what I want it to say.
Honestly, as I said, I can’t tell you that I am doing the right thing. Maybe not. Like I said, it is a risk. I think we have the best local football news coverage in the country so there is potential downside and no upside to us carrying stuff like this.
But that is why we did it.
Lasana Liburd you would convince me if the views published are in the minority. In fact the view published is the norm. And it is bigotry. Why on earth are we giving voice to established, normalized bigotry?
Rhoda I think if the view was in the minority then I would be irresponsible to publish. But if it is from a significant segment of our population, then we need to hear, understand and address if we are to move forward as a people.
I need to understand and listen to bigotry to move forward as a people?
Lemme go back to wining and flinging it up, oui.
Lasana Liburd I do not agree with this at all. I can’t break down why right now, but you need to take a stance on what you support and what you do not. We need to understand how people change their minds and it largely has to do with cherry picking ideas.
People who agree are going say yes, people who disagree are going to say no. This is not helping and only further polarizes groups.
Keita I did say what I believe in. And like I said I think people have expressed themselves eloquently.
Rhoda, I’m not asking you to become a bigot. But isn’t the world better when we can show the flaws in a weak bigoted argument?
It can be tedious and vexatious. I get that. And I’d never swamp us with toxic stuff. I promise.
But I believe in confronting things head on. I always have.
Rhoda I feel you need to write a letter on the role of media and I will write on how people actually change their minds.
Lasana Liburd stand your ground, Sir!??????
Me? I is ah armchair warrior. You know this.
Media doh take me on.
Everybody and Their Hulsie does get a platform to spout their mythologies unchallenged.
#wineandflingitup
Keita we published CAISO stuff before. And a letter from Colin Robinson.
And it’s not about what can garner hits. Website would be very different if that was seriously what I wanted.
I would never criticize the PNM, I wouldn’t write on extrajudicial killings, etc.
Lasana Liburd…enslavement has a Biblical argument, as does gender discrimination…are we going to promote those PoVs too for the sake of balance?
Ah love yuh like cook food but yuh pissing on my ass with this one.
Barbara Jenkins….peep the discussion.
Honestly, there’s so much unprovable stuff in that “article” that I’m pretty sure it was not just made up, but made up while on drugs or something. There’s no logic, no consistency, no science, no fact
Rhoda we will absolutely publish a different view point. Fingers crossed Nigel Myers will hook us up. ?
Lasana Liburd lol quick fast??♂️??♂️??♂️??♂️??♂️
Really, Lasana, you call up my name to justify your bad judgment?
Not sure this is properly called a “religious” argument at all- you’re assuming this view has some currency in the Church – but it’s not what I’ve read coming from the Pope. It’s risky business that- because of its not doctrine, it could properly be labeled bigotry, which probably shouldn’t be given a voice.
Justin i was viewing a programme of religious scholars Harvard and Yale no less, and I had to be picked up off of the floor when they agreed that the Catholic Church has not practiced Christianity in ages. The Pope is a Catholic point of reference but certainly not a Christian one.
Dunno what to say nah. I’m personally not bothered by homosexuality. What two (or more) consensual adults get up to in their private space is their business, as far as I am concerned.
I don’t want to see it. But I don’t lose any sleep over it.
So I don’t see things in the same vein as the author. But I do know that religious people are a significant segment of our population.
So at least we have their view. And some people have offered very eloquent thought provoking responses for which I am grateful.
I can’t fault someone for being religious and consistently applying those beliefs, so long as they don’t wish harm on anyone else.
Thing is can denying human rights to some be considered harmful?
Like I said, some have been far more nuanced and eloquent than me in tackling those points.
Slavery was once justified by a religious argument……
It feels like a click bait post personally. One to stir the pot.
Exactly. Unbothered also. But people can state their opinions, perspectives and biblical truth! Now that the gays are in vogue, why should other voices be silenced . Say no to bullying✊?
I realized after this author’s 2nd article reading anything she wrote is vexatious…so I wont even bother to read it
Onika Nkrumah-Lakhan I am really not into people who believe in a book/teachings or freaking ethics the colonizers used to brainwash us. Do you understand the dissonance there?
Seeing that religious folks take up a large portion of the population, how do we determine what beliefs carry more weight?
Hindus, Muslims and Christians have varying beliefs. You Christians would not be very happy having to live under Sharia law. So….
If your religion is teaching you to hate people you need to check yourself and your beliefs.
Not sure this is properly called a “religious” argument at all- you’re assuming this view has some currency in the Church – but it’s not what I’ve read coming from the Pope. It’s risky business that- because of its not doctrine, it could properly be labeled bigotry, which probably shouldn’t be given a voice.
Justin Phelps ah the Pope??…moving swiftly on.
Keita absolutely not click bait. Our columns never get the most traffic and Wired868 gets good readership with what people expect from us. And that is Sport and satire.
Believe me, these columns are risks not assets. Clickbait? Absolutely not. The safe thing is not to publish.
Justin that is why I said religion but don’t specify a church. Religious people take their cue from scriptures and not from societal norms. So even though they take different stances on certain topics, they generally speaking operate outside the society from an ideological standpoint. In my opinion. And I’m no expert!
Rachel ????above is why we published.
Nothing to be bothered about, God gave free will …to choose Life or Death. No need for anyone to make enemies on this issue, He said ” every man must seek his own salvation with fear and trembling “. Homosexuality is one sin, we will all be called to account for all of our doings. Simple.
Well said Ucill Cambridge
Anyway folks, it was nice interacting with you all. I must take my leave. Please do have a great night.
Here is another gem for you bible lovers https://www.facebook.com/museumoftheBible/photos/a.656534441128184.1073741830.647684042013224/1553255748122711/?type=3&theater
I’ll just leave this here. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S1-ip47WYWc
Oh they get conveniently silent when presented with these arguments….cherry picking is much easier to defend…
very disappointed that u have gone down to publish this assness…apparently is a slow news day…or the homegirl is your woman who u wanted to please on valentines day by publishing her crap…
Good entertainment! ????
“Akilah Holder”… look how I going and remember that idiots name. Lol!
Dwayne I tried to explain why we published in a few comments. No, I am not sure that we got it right. And we will take it on a case by case basis.
But the general view is that to advance as a society, we have to understand our diverse opinions. Not necessarily accept but understand. That’s the first step in the long road to consensus.
Noting is wrong with person giving their opinion but when they start to preach and impose their religious beliefs on others that when the line has been crossed
Dwayne we have gone through so much as a people to get here and I just don’t think we will melt in the sun because someone quoted Leviticus. There have been some very interesting rebuttals and I’ve had an offer or three to do a letter in response. I hope at least one of those people follow through.
Sometimes I wonder why people can’t express their views. It seems that straight persons in society are always being punished and silenced for their beliefs. Do we have to agree wholeheartedly with the views of the gay and lesbian community? Smh
I’m straight and I don’t agree, so try not to generalise.
Oh Averil St Clair- Celestain did I tag your name. I don’t think so.
What the discussion should be is Equal Rights (not under the Church but under the Law) Do they have a right to be the people that they choose to be, Do they have a right to live the life that they choose for themselves, and if one should die Do they have the legal right to inherit and make decisions for that person. Do I have the right to disagree with their lifestyle. But in disagreeing do I have the right to deny them a Job a home or anything that is legally available to a Citizen of this Country. If it is Religious reasons then under that do I have the right to deny them my service in a Private or Public Job, And last Do they have the right to walk these streets and not be abused beaten or killed. While I may not agree with the Gay Lifestyle and Have issues with Transgender persons because that is my me and my beliefs and my rights and as much as I am against it, I don’t have the right legally to deny any citizen of this country their rights, and Religiously because for The Bible State “Do not Judge, Unless Ye be Judge” I do believe it continuously states who has the last say, Of which I don’t have to answer for these people I have to answer for myself. And we sit in Judgement of these people while this country continues in some of the most corrupt practices. My mother taught me A sin is a sin is a sin, and take the beam out of your eye before you study the one in your brothers.
Yes I do agree with you We have the right to not agree with people of the Gay Community and it does get on my nerves when I am beaten down for expressing my views, and that is where the problem lies. While I may agree with them having certain Rights they have to accept that I do not nor will ever agree that your lifestyle is correct, this is not a Santa Claus and Easter Bunny issue this is telling me to deny my Beliefs.
I’d take you all more seriously if you used something other than just the Bible as your basis. What if the person isn’t Christian?
Antoinette Lewis I am totally with you. Emile they cannot be Christian, your business what you take seriously or not.
Lol!
Live your life how you want and go to hell or heaven,it’s your choice, I choose the ladies,I am going to heaven.
Um, Wired 868 slow news day huh? Apparently homegirl was bored & needed to express her latent frustrations in the form of this homophobic rant. God sent Jesus for the sinners, not the sanctimonious. What grown folks do in their beds are their concern only. Must know the miserable people eh! Smh.
Just a letter to the editor. It is not the views of the website.
Good thing I didn’t say it was.
Right. A “responsible” media house publishes hate speech… And it’s “just a letter”…
????
“Media house”… anyway…
Kwasi if it was a call to arms or violence against any people, we wouldn’t publish.
If a section of our society is airing their concern then I think the one way for us to be sure we don’t improve is by refusing to publish.
Because there are enough people who share this view and they will continue to feed off each other.
So I’d prefer to listen and, if possible, rebut with an intellectually superior argument.
The easy thing is to ignore and ban everything that makes us uncomfortable. It would be easier for me too as I wouldn’t have to be defending publishing a view that I don’t agree with.
Urhm… I did say hate speech, right?
Dear “media house” defending hate speech… try not to talk to me. Vybz? You’re laughable at best. And I already had my morning’s fill.
You see the next coonimooni talking about shutting down Dimanche gras!? ?????
And the same people I told… the same old ass add people who running out of ideas and WOULDN’T let we een… BLAMING GOV’T! LOL!!
If you want to publish the letters of idle little girls who pim bunning them when the night come… who jaded over some man who find heself… who living in a bible… who hopeless, frustrated and stupid and want to spread hate to deal with it… like a child… That is your ass business.
Trinidad has no journalism. We all know it. Nobody cares.
Thanks. Bai.
Kwasi it must be nice to have all the answers. We can only try and learn as we go along.
Who knows. Maybe your way is best and we have only to insult people we don’t agree with to make it a better world.
For now, we are trying something different.
1. Not different. It’s called “regressive”…
2. You keep tagging me. I absolutely don’t like it. Please stop.
3. Where was the insult? You felt insulted? Poor you. Does this letter of “Love” warrant any thought on my part? Naw. It doesn’t.
I know you my brethren. Trinidadians, especially, have a funny way of showing “love…”…
Tell that lady to use that fervor to get her shit together. Nobody has time for it. THREE FUNERAL NOTICES came up in my feed this morning… then this shit.
I mean… I too grown to be bothered by you, my brethren. I have my life to live.
Now I said bai… and you tagged me… So let’s try “hello”
Thanks.
Whenever anyone goes, “Well GOD says…” and then they pull out a BOOK, written by men, edited by men, translated and re-translated and put together by men and full of OBVIOUS human tampering, you cannot take them seriously at all.
Just to illustrate my point, there is actually no ancient Hebrew or Greek corollary to the word “homosexuality” or “homosexual” or its meaning. If your translation of the bible has the term “homosexuality” in it, you can bet it was edited after 1945. In fact, you would be shocked at how much human tampering is involved in the bible. “Homosexuality” is a medical term coined in the late 1800s when human sexuality began to be scientifically studied for the first time. The 19th Century medical term for someone innately attracted to their own gender rather than the opposite gender, is a concept foreign to the bible. The bible deals with people’s actions or roles not their psychological orientation.
Most people are so ignorant about how the bible came to be, they actually think Matthew, Mark, Luke and John were written by their namesakes. It is a MAN-MADE book, reflecting the opinions of MEN, primitive, desert tribal, ignorant, iron aged men living in Northern Palestine. Men who did not know where the sun went at night and thought birds’ blood cured leprosy. While they might have occasionally hit on a few universal truths,a they missed the mark ethically on many issues and were ignorant about even more.
Most people are so ignorant about how the bible came to be, they actually think Matthew, Mark, Luke and John were written by their namesakes. It is a MAN-MADE book, reflecting the opinions of MEN, primitive, desert tribal, ignorant, iron aged men living in Northern Palestine. Men who did not know where the sun went at night and thought birds’ blood cured leprosy. While they might have occasionally hit on a few universal truths, as many ancient writings sometimes do, they missed the mark ethically on many issues and were ignorant about even more.
The bible has been edited, added to, mistranslated and in the case of the bible-thumpers who like to take it completely out of context, misappropriated to support whatever is their latest bigoted stance.
True,indeed, after all god created light(photons)n on the first day BUt the source of photons –the Sun — was created on the fourth day..
Indeed! I wonder if anyone here were diagnosed with Hansen’s disease (leprosy) which we know from science is caused by Mycobacterium leprae and Mycobacterium lepromatosis, would they go to see a dermatologist and get antibiotic treatments or would you apply the bible’s advice:
Get two birds. Kill one. Dip the live bird in the blood of the dead one. Sprinkle the blood on the leper seven times, and then let the blood-soaked bird fly away. Next find a lamb and kill it. Wipe some of its blood on the patient’s right ear, thumb, and big toe. Sprinkle seven times with oil and wipe some of the oil on his right ear, thumb and big toe. Repeat. Finally find another pair of birds. Kill one and dip the live bird in the dead bird’s blood. Wipe some blood on the patient’s right ear, thumb, and big toe. Sprinkle the house with blood 7 times.– Leviticus 14:2-52
Let us never forget that the bible and many ancient books were written by bronze and iron-age men unaware of how much of the world worked. They did not know what caused earthquakes, storms or even that women contributed 50% of the genetic material towards babies. Sometimes they got it right but many times, they fell woefully short of what is actually true.
And Jessica Joseph wins the thread folks!!!!
Jessica Joseph you keep believing that
Bonnie Khan ??????what she win?
Onika Nkrumah-Lakhan It’s not about what I believe but about what is actual fact. Most people are woefully biblically illiterate and have no idea how the bible as they know it go to be what it is. Some of us have done the research and know better. Nobody has been able to provide any valid evidence that the bible is anything but the work of man.
I have read the bible, and studied extensively and I am very versed in Christian theology and comparative religion so, I tend to stick with what the most learned people have to say on the issue.
If you belong to a religious sect that condemns LGBT people, that is your business. Practice your religion and apply it to yourself. It has no bearing on anyone else. The most condemned sin in the bible is worshiping any other deity but Yahweh, it actually made the TOP TWO of the ten commandments, homosexuality did not.
So what does this mean for all non-Yahweh worshipers in our plural society? Do we strip all Hindus, Buddhists, Orisha and agnostic and atheist people of their rights? Do we ban their ability to worship because it is against the religion of some?
0/10 for critical thinking lol
Such an ignorant article. Happy Valentine’s day.
It is all in Scripture. God loves His people regardless of their orientation what He does not condone according th Scripture is the acting out of those desires.
Just tuh-DAY this came up in my memories inno….TUHDAY
https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=10155889074405659&id=621320658
Q and I too? Hmmm, can’t and won’t keep up
Lasana, do you try to spite by publishing these articles? Wha we do yuh sooooooo?!. Please note I have read not one single word…i glance at the author and I have zero interest….
Dunno why but I did. Just take in the very last line. “And that neither Mr Harnarine nor Mr Khan nor anyone else of their ilk any longer harbours any illusions about how strong is the Living God’s active disapproval of their perverted lifestyles.”
big fat long watery STEUPS
I was very confused by these references to God. As far as I know Zeus has made no pronouncements on the subject.
I feel sorry for Christians. Their religion is toxic. Imagine giving a free pass to slave owners but persecuting a gay person who has no business with you. I will say unapologetically, Christianity is a big load of dotishness. And it will be dead within decades.
Entering into a passage that was made for waste deposit is more toxic than what you are rambling about
??♀️
and that is your or my business? Gay people have been always been around and will always be around.
Apparently once you’re not comfortable with something, it shouldn’t be legal. You are very important apparently.
Has been and will always be does not make it right. Its still stink and nasty
To you.
Typical Trini. Always up in everyone business.
Breaking and entering has always been around also. Long before I was born so what is your point?
jesus christ. One is non consensual.
shouldnt have to point that out to grown ass man
Having consensual sex with a 12 year old has also been around long time. Do you really want to debate stinkness with me? Give up
Andrew Gioannetti he’s not in anyone’s business, that might actually be you?He’s commenting on a public post. Can he live or nah?
I do give up, straw man.
Don’t matter how you try to disguise nastiness, it will not make it clean
Kenroy Ambris I think that you spend more time thinking of gay sex than gay men. The vagina also passes waste too. Them lady parts pass pee.
Christopher, you starting to sound really uneducated and annoying now. Quit before you damage your brain cells more
Btw there a 12 year old child cannot give consent. Also, these folks seems to have completely avoided addressing my question concerning slavery (as well as misogyny and infanticide ) in the Bible. Oh right! That doesn’t suit your agenda!
And your point Kenroy I thinking homophobes are really under gays.
See Numbers 31:18 Only the young girls who are virgins may live; you may keep them for yourselves.
Andrew Gioannetti the Creator never endorsed the European form of brutal chattel slavery. The Caucasians pioneered that particular form.
Wow Onika. What a pathetic attempt.
Onika Nkrumah-Lakhan You would say that wouldnt you, other than conceding your riduculous point that is what you have to say. Slavery is slavery. I deviated from my position not to argue with fools especially religious ones. They will bring you to their level, they will be slippery as an eel. The lack reason they rely on revealed truth.
The writings of European slave-owners are very well known. Christian slave owners and their supporters like Rev. Thomas Stringfellow, George Fitzhugh who claimed slavery is biblical and God’s will used a similar methodology with Genesis 9:25-27, Exodus 21:20-21, Leviticus25:44-45, 1 Timothy 6:1-5, 1 Peter 2:18-29.
Andrew Gioannetti let’s be honest
You are sad.
Christopher Lewis small point of correction. I’m not religious and I’m far from a fool✋?
Onika Nkrumah-Lakhan You are a stranger to honesty and science. I bet prior to this post you were unaware of the bibical treatment for leprosy, except prayer,
Onika Nkrumah-Lakhan Yes you are
Anal sex =/= homosexuality. Anal sex is neither a gay only act or even something all gay men do.
The whole anal sex argument is a non-sequitur. The reason it is used in anti-gay arguments is because most people are squeamish about anal sex. However, we know from the Kama Sutra, to Greek and the art of Ido-era Japan we see it was merely considered just another sexual position for men and women and/or men and men. Victorian era literature calls the anus “the little rosebud”. The oldest known depictions of heterosexual anal appear on Peruvian pottery (c. 300 A.D.). In Peru 1,700 years ago, hetero-anal intercourse was by no means rare. On surviving pottery depicting erotic art, one-third of it shows hetero-anal intercourse. Chinese and Japanese woodblock prints (16th to19th centuries) depict heterosexual anal intercourse fairly frequently. And ever since the invention of photography (1840) and motion pictures (1890), pornography has shown hetero-anal play.
In fact according to the CDC, over 40% of straight couples practice it. 40% of the heterosexual population is bigger than the entire gay male population.
Andrew Gioannetti ok??
Christopher Lewis ok I forgot that we pitch marbles together, so you would know?
Jessica Joseph the little rosebud?lmbao, sounds most un-Victorian to me, that was a well known prudish era
Onika Nkrumah-Lakhan No I read your masterpiece of nonsense. Best Wishes
Christopher Lewis kindly depart with your disrespectful dotishness??
Onika Nkrumah-Lakhan This is the Age Of Information. Libraries are available online for you to verify every single thing. So this is not about comparing personal opinions and conjecture for me. It is about presenting actual historical information.
borrowed from a wise person:
Thank you for doing so much to educate people regarding God’s Law. I have learned a great deal from this article show, and I try to share that knowledge with as many people as I can. When someone tries to defend the homosexual lifestyle, for example, I simply remind him that Leviticus 18:22 clearly states it to be an abomination. End of debate.
I do need some advice from you, however, regarding some of the specific laws and how to best follow them.
a) When I burn a bull on the altar as a sacrifice, I know it creates a pleasing odor for the Lord (Lev 1:9). The problem is my neighbors. They claim the odor is not pleasing to them. Should I smite them?
b) I would like to sell my daughter into slavery, as sanctioned in Exodus 21:7. In this day and age, what do you think would be a fair price for her?
c) I know that I am allowed no contact with a woman while she is in her period of menstrual uncleanliness (Lev 15:19-24). The problem is, how do I tell? I have tried asking, but most women take offense.
d) Lev. 25:44 states that I may indeed possess slaves, both male and female, provided they are purchased from neighboring nations. A friend of mine claims that this applies to grenadians, but not Guyanese. Can you clarify? Why can’t I own Guyanese?
e) I have a neighbor who insists on working on the Sabbath. Exodus 35:2 clearly states he should be put to death. Am I morally obligated to kill him myself?
f) A friend of mine feels that even though eating shellfish is an Abomination (Lev 11:10), it is a lesser abomination than homosexuality. I don’t agree. Can you settle this?
g) Lev 21:20 states that I may not approach the altar of God if I have a defect in my sight. I have to admit that I wear reading glasses. Does my vision have to be 20/20, or is there some wiggle room here?
h) Most of my male friends get their hair trimmed, including the hair around their temples, even though this is expressly forbidden by Lev 19:27. How should they die?
i) I know from Lev 11:6-8 that touching the skin of a dead pig makes me unclean, but may I still play rugby if I wear gloves?
j) My uncle has a farm. He violates Lev 19:19 by planting two different crops in the same field, as does his wife by wearing garments made of two different kinds of thread (cotton/polyester blend). He also tends to curse and blaspheme a lot. Is it really necessary that we go to all the trouble of getting the whole town together to stone them? (Lev 24:10-16) Couldn’t we just burn them to death at a private family affair like we do with people who sleep with their in-laws? (Lev. 20:14)
I know you have studied these things extensively, so I am confident you can help. Thank you for reminding us that God’s word is eternal and unchanging.
Your God has power to End world hunger cure disease stop wars human trafficking but yet all he seemd to be interested in when human get naked. As Seneca said : Religion is regarded by the common people as true, by the wise as false, and by the rulers as useful” And Jean Mesler : If God himself was not able to render human nature sinless, what right had he to punish men for not being sinless. But really why are you encouraging a believer in debunked fairy tales a voice her. Any educated person must know by now that the Bible is not proof of any god and that its really the satings of uneducated got herders.
Ok????
Christopher Lewis, mankind has free will. He chose to disobey God, which resulted in all the suffering going on. If mankind turned back to God, the suffering would stop, but all around the world, we’re kicking God out. When you legalize something he condemns, and continuously disobey, how you expect him to get involved? Ask yourself, if someone didn’t want you to intervene in their lives, would you? If they kept rejecting you, unless your pushy, would you bother with them? I’m sure the answer is a resounding no. And God is not pushy, he’s a gentleman. So if you don’t want him in your life, he will not get involved. So who at fault? Man.
Christian apologetic created by St. Augustine to fill a real void in their failed and false idealogy
God does not Exist
Christopher Lewis according to you??The world’s most credible source??
The existence of God is the null hypothesis par excellence. You posit it you prove it. The Bible is full of contradictions . Many so called Christians never read the bible from cover to cover just the good parts. Start by looking at this http://www.evilbible.com/ where the vicious truth of the bible is set out using the very words of the bible.
Akilah Holder “When you legalize something he condemns, and continuously disobey, how you expect him to get involved? Ask yourself, if someone didn’t want you to intervene in their lives, would you? If they kept rejecting you, unless your pushy, would you bother with them? I’m sure the answer is a resounding no.”
Barring my own views on what you have written, can you tell me why you have placed such limits on the power of your God? I can never understand man’s rationale in explaining what God would or would not do. How do you know?
As I said before, if we continue with this dotishness, one day man will be fighting for the rights to have sex with animals, and there will also be CLOWNS supporting them saying that “it’s their rights and we have to respect it” I prefer to be thrown in the hottest part of hell fire than to support this NASTINESS. thinking about man sexing with man is really disgusting and can never be right don’t matter how you try to explain to me. If the GOD that I believe in sanction that, I don’t want to be nowhere close to him. But Im safe because I know he did not. PEACE
Excuse me they are already lobbying for the right to sex animals plus Germany has an animal brothel, for the animal lovers,wink nudge! And NAMBLA is bringing up the rear(no pun intended), with their lobby for their pedophiliac right to abuse people’s children ok. ??????♀️??♀️?
Onika Nkrumah-Lakhan Yes, Onika, you’re correct. Was going to point that out.
I believe alyuh joking, that not sounding right
Onika Nkrumah-Lakhan Go Germany I think as a man or woman thinks so is sheep
Kenroy Ambris No joke here nuh boy. Google it. Things that bad.
Christopher Lewis ?
I fell you like animals Hint Animals are for sacrifice not sex
If that comment make you feel important, such is life. I will not burst your bubble
But Kenroy, why you hadda think about it? There’s plenty more things going on in TT and the world that could occupy your thoughts :-). I doh walk around thinking about other people’s sex lives cause that ain’t my business!
Bonnie, I also don’t walk around thinking about it. It’s the last thing on my mind. All I do is comment on it whenever the topic is in front of me.
The story about Germany is unsubstantiated, stop spreading nonsense: https://www.snopes.com/animal-brothels-open-germany-migrant-population-hits-22-percent/
I believe you Kenroy Ambris. And we could could have opposing views and still be good, yes?
Trins Christian swallow all kind of propoganda . Only the so called christian ralk about sex with animals .I wonder why ..
Sex with an animal could never be consensual (unless you know how to speak horse or goat) – that is rape – so you can’t compare the legitimacy of that kind of behavior to that of two consenting adults of the same sex… that’s just a nonsense argument, no two ways about it.
Duane, wait and see, in years to come some nasty stinking jackass will come up with an argument just the same way they did to make pushing your dick into a shit hole legal
Kenroy Ambris, I feel you have to try to challenge yourself to think higher thoughts, not let yourself be consumed by this gutterishness. Try nah. Is only allyuh making this a purely physical thing while everybody else on a different level.
Bonnie, Thinking higher thoughts mean sweeping the hard truth under the table.
Logic: why is it OK for the media to get to the bottom of everything by doing indept investigations and unearthing everything down to the last details but in this situation it is OK to cover up the nastiness behind guy people? Double standard
Onika Nkrumah-Lakhan get your facts straight…there is no such thing in germany …what u are quoting was false news that was circulated on social media a few months ago…
Kenroy – just because you think it’s nastiness doesn’t make it nastiness. And no one is covering up anything. People just have different perspectives. I for one think the age-old animal analogy is nonsensical. Accepting Homosexuality between two consenting adults is not a gateway to accept rape of an animal. I can’t reason with that logic.
Duane, I believe that I’m older than you and I’m old and experienced enough to know what nastiness is. I also believe that you know what nastiness is but you convince yourself that it is OK so nothing I say can change your mind and I will not try.
After all is said and done, no amount of disinfectant can clean that nastiness.
For me, what is nasty, what is o.k. etc… in this context is all subjective. It has nothing to do with experience either. What I’m reading from you and other like-minded posters is pure regurgitation…i.e. you have been taught something, you accepted it, and now you are passing it along it as it was passed along to you. There is nothing original in what you’re saying and there’s nothing that you are saying that hasn’t been said for generations and simply passed on from one generation to the next. All I’m saying is not everyone is taught the same thing, and not everyone accepts what they have been taught – so people will have different perspectives…and you can’t invalidate someone else’s point of view merely on the strength of your conviction. Life doesn’t work that way. I’m sure your experience must have taught you that too 🙂
No one believes in change more than i do. Most of the stuff that i was taught growing up i dont believe and i made changes as i see fit. Most of all i have my life to live and so do you and if you see it fit to make love to a man who has a dick bigger or smaller than yours, thats your prerogative, i will still sleep comfortable at nights hugging my beautiful WIFE, who has breast and vagina and produced 2 beautiful children from my sperm.
And because there’re “two consensual adults” involved, means it’s “normal”. It’s unbelievable that humans think it’s normal. If animals believe so, I can understand them. Never the human being. No Bible is needed to explain that this was NEVER meant to be. Only a matter of time before the production of the human being will decrease significantly. Maybe they think the world is too populated.
Actually, gay sex is good.
That’s one of the main reasons today why it’s so rampant, especially with women. It’s a vice. No longer to do with “genes”. They’re living a fantasy, which the movie industry helped to promote.
Nope, the reason it seems more prevalent these days than in the past is because the language for feeling attraction to the same sex/gender is much more widely known and the environment is much less hostile towards it than even a few years ago. Consequently, more people recognise their attraction and then act on it.
Katherine, are you trying to justify stinkness? Something that’s full of diseases? Are you right in your mind? What year did you hit your head very hard and loose most of your senses?
Nope, because being gay is not “stink” and is no more risky for disease than heterosexuality.
Are you serious Katherine, you believe that pushing a dick into a shit hole is not stink? This really tells me a lot about you. It’s a shame the nastiness that people think is normal.
Very soon you will tell me that it’s OK to suck into a man’s shit hole. You all are a bunch of sick people
That particular sexual habit is not practised by every gay person but also is practised by many straight people. You may not like it or have any interest in it which is fine. You should only have the sex you want to have. But what other people do with their bodies in a consensual and appropriate manner is really not something that needs to trouble you. Particularly when the behaviour in question is not unhealthy or harmful or outside the bounds of normal human risk taking.
Ma’am, IT IS UNHEALTHY!!!! What part of messing up in SHIT is healthy?
Also you are taking risk. SHIT is full of diseases. YOU ARE NOT MAKING ANY SENSE TO ME
The rectal cavity is generally cleaned before any sex acts are performed. It’s called an enema. Many participants also use gloves and condoms and dental dams for sterility.
You are very sick in your mind for trying to justify this stinkness. I don’t want to hear anymore.
Katherine McEwan that definitely sounds like fun???♀️
It’s not for everyone. Some people like it, others don’t. In any case, it’s not a marker of value as a person or morality as a person.
Women out there (especially) in the foreign countries, pursue other women sexually. They will tell other women (that they don’t even know) that they want to “eat” them. Can you imagine a man telling a woman that? They’d blow their covers, over being “harassed” by a “nasty man”. But as I said, homosexuality is a VICE more than anything else, especially for women, because of how “beautiful” it is. So with the promotion of it in the movies, sitcom, porn, some will fantasize about the idea and may eventually live it, then become bi-sexuals or full blown lesbians.
Homosexuality is a CHOICE, but these “pressure groups” are out there are attempting to impose their lifestyle on the masses as if it’s a “normal” behaviour, which makes them somewhat an “endangered species”.
They should all live on an island by themselves, happily and merrily, without having to think about who’re “against them” and deh “rights”. There’ll be no more reproduction taking place and they will eventually evaporate.
cant imagine there’s a single sentence of value/substance in this article.
Didn’t realize Wired868 was into the rights and wrongs of how people live their lives now.
Shari, please know you can live your life how you like. That is the opinion of one contributor and not the view of Wired868.
Just like every newspaper on the planet has a variety of views on its letter page.
Which God?? Steups. “All men are equal in the eyes of God. Would that all Gods were equal in the eyes of man.” Peter Minshall.
“But do not use the name of God to legitimize your cause, do not twist His words and do not dishonour His name.”
Wars, slavery…
Everybody always seemed to know what God say, what he didn’t say, talking on his behalf, what he want, didn’t want etc. Meanwhile people does cherry pick want dey want to believe in.
“Those who indulge in sexual sin, or who worship idols, or commit adultery, or are male prostitutes, or practice homosexuality, none of these will inherit the Kingdom of God.”
Well ah guess most people gone through then. Isn’t fornication a sexual sin? Ah wonder why she singled out male prostitutes, de female ones getting a free pass?
Anyway, I realize long time dat when it come to talking about religion or religious viewpoints, logic and reasoning does go out de window. It does end up being about power and ego.
Oh so great a contribution. I love what you saying. Couldnt express it better.
You forget to mention the hypocracy thing too.
That train has already left the station, and it is a matter of when rather than if it arrives. Our gay brothers and sisters are not second class citizens, and in time, will (deservedly) get every right that straight people like me enjoy. This is not a popular opinion in our Caribbean civilisation — as Ralph Gonsalves likes to refer to us. And yes, my own views are formed from 2 decades in the UK. But hey, gay rights are human rights. It will be a long, long time before gay PDA, for example, can be openly demonstrated without causing some unease in our societies. And in truth, I can’t quite get used to seeing gay couples canoodling in some countries besides our own. We will never be Greek Street in London, and we shouldn’t try to be. And on scriptural strictures, I’m not best equipped to argue. But on the broader outlines of the LGBTQI issues, that train has left the station already.
Orin Gordon, you should know by now that this is not a thread that’s worth any kind of balanced response, but good of you to provide it :-). Yuh read all that scripture? Is lorse everybody done lorse arredi, regardless of belief.
Bonnie, I live in hope that we can disagree agreeably on these things. I try to be reasonable and rational, and hopefully it’ll be reciprocated. 🙂
I will hope along with you. Just remember the writer believes that God’s wrath was delivered upon the states that legalised same sex marriage. Whilst I do like to understand all viewpoints, I’ve learned that trying to reason with narrow minds + public platforms + unverifiable sources go nowhere. But I’ll cheer you on from the sidelines whilst enjoying having wonderful friends of all persuasion.
“Is lorse everybody done lorse arredi…” lololol take win Bonnie.
Well if the Bible say it, it must be true! Bun dem!! Bun dem!!! Bun dem!!! Bird, yuh giving me grey hairs with these posts man. Stress.
Hey. The theological side is outta my league. But Nigel Myers gave it a good go below. 🙂
Lasana Liburd why would you post this letter to the editor?
Jessica Joseph is schooling them.
Keita we definitely don’t agree with every opinion we publish but post when we think the person has a right to express their view or because we feel it can start a worthwhile debate.
Now there have been some topics that really made me think long and hard because it is difficult to see a positive thread coming from something when the authors believes they have all the answers, are very bitter and divisive or is closed off from debate in other ways. (I’m talking in general here and not necessarily about this piece).
In this case, I decided that religious persons are part of our society and I wouldn’t want to deny them a chance to address the public so to speak. I also believe there is a big danger in creating an echo chamber where you self-censor to fit the perceived ideology of your readers.
So I was nervous about this but felt I had to do it to be ideologically consistent.
And, not for the first time, I breathed a sigh of relief when I saw that readers were indeed able to address topic in responsible, mature way.
For sure, this could have gone very wrong…
Lasana Liburd I feel this needs an in person conversation, the article does not even present a good debate on the religious side of the debate. There was once a large section of the population who wanted to maintain slavery. You argument is a logical fallacy called an appeal to authority and it leads us to content that is geared at the least common denominator. If your point was that by igniting a conversation we educate readers through the comments, then fine, I get that, but I am not convinced by your argument, but hey you publish what you wish. I do find that often the best things are in the comments.
Keita I agree with you about the comments for sure. That’s where arguments get tested and sometimes pulled apart.
Where is the lowest common denominator though? Check the thread and see for yourself.
Wired868 doesn’t attract the lowest common denominator. This website started in January 2012. The lowest common denominator would have found us by now.
Keita if we were in slavery times, I would publish the views of the slave master. Because I’d know that we would then dismantle those views.
Isn’t that the better way to win the war?
I feel I need to write you a letter.
Keita we would publish even if you criticize our stance. And we would take those views into account too going forward.
Like I said, I am not saying I have all the answers. I’m just trying to be consistent myself. And trying not to blow myself up in the process!
Keita, like every good editor and proprietor, Lasana recognises the value of clicks and engagement. You mighten’t agree with what Akilah has to say (and I don’t), but her point of view is widely held (yeah, I know that’s the door to all multitude of justifications, but still…)
What religious side of what debate..there is no religious debate to this.
Come with it Sis, talk de tings dem. #politicallyincorrect #facts
https://users.drew.edu/~jlenz/whynot.html
He could not even get the definition of a Christian correct..somehow making the grevious error of lumping Christianity with Catholicism. So yes I understand why he is not a Christian, and if I were as mistaught as he is, I would not be either.